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  • Metal shrinker / Tuck inducer 

    I recently completed construction of a hand operated Metal shrinker / Tuck inducer. I don't claim the design as my own. I would have purchased one if they were available but sadly they are not. I was sort of forced down this road because the shrinker stretchers don't work on the scale I will need for my project and I can't afford a multi thousand dollar mechanical hammer to operate thumb nail dies. So this method will need to do the trick for me.

    The part taped on is just for ballast. It is just enough to return the handle to the up position. Overall the machine is reasonably easy to use.

    The machine does the job it was designed to do. The first time I tried it I got the technique wrong and allowed the tuck to develop on the convex part of the bend. So then when I went to capture the tuck all the metal escaped and ended up flat again.

    I have since tried it again but taking care to make sure the tuck develops in the concave part of the bend. That allows the piece to fit in the concave part of the stump which stops the metal escaping and shrinks it as intended.

    It is a slower method than a thumb nail die, but it will do for my purposes.


    Click image for larger version

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  • #2
    That is OK if works for you, ..... BUT! in over 50 Years of shaping panels (of all sorts ) I never had to use such a gadget to do deep shrinking ,there are other ways ,....
    having said that ,.... when looking at what you are building I can not see where you would need to do such deep shrinking ?
    Peter T.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Peter Tommasini View Post
      That is OK if works for you, ..... BUT! in over 50 Years of shaping panels (of all sorts ) I never had to use such a gadget to do deep shrinking ,there are other ways ,....
      having said that ,.... when looking at what you are building I can not see where you would need to do such deep shrinking ?
      Peter T.
      OK thanks Peter. I'll do some searching for the other methods.

      PS I expect to need deep shrinking around the headlight and taillight areas. I am basing this on the method shown in the Youtube videos posted by ProShaper.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by galderdi View Post

        OK thanks Peter. I'll do some searching for the other methods.

        PS I expect to need deep shrinking around the headlight and taillight areas. I am basing this on the method shown in the Youtube videos posted by ProShaper.
        You are in extremely talented hands here.....

        and as for the Utube sucking leech..... well i’m not gonna say anything more.....😂😂😂😂😉

        I believe Peter worked for this Italian company.... Click image for larger version  Name:	F50354E3-636B-4A0E-B97E-70D69B0E95CF.jpeg Views:	3 Size:	2.34 MB ID:	6030
        Last edited by Moving molecules .; 09-04-21, 07:59 AM.
        https://www.precisionpanelcraft.co.uk/

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by galderdi View Post

          OK thanks Peter. I'll do some searching for the other methods.

          PS I expect to need deep shrinking around the headlight and taillight areas. I am basing this on the method shown in the Youtube videos posted by ProShaper.
          /////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

          After seeing that gadget you have made , I had a funny feeling that you been watching ''our friend ''making panels for the spider , you can follow his methods ( if you like ) but be prepare for a lot unnecessary work , a lot of frustrations and possibly never fitting the buck properly + using a lot of filler to have a good finish

          Again...it's your choice . and ..... do not forget to make a FSP and FACILITATORS as well that way you will '' facilitate'' your frustrations as well ,..... meaning another useless gadget of his inventions !

          Peter T.

          PS if you need help with your build I am sure some one here will help with suggestions and methods you will be learning a good way and making your work a lot easier .

          Comment


          • #6
            Hi Greg. You have a great project underway. I am not sucking up to Peter but the reality is we started this forum to ensure that the time honoured and tested methods of metal shaping are slowly being lost. Not from the lack of interest but because if you have a camera and a Ewe Tube channel people will assume you are a guru.

            I laugh now when I look back at some of the guys I used to follow. I didn't know what I didn't know and with hindsight I now realise I was gullible. I was desperate to learn but didn't realise most were self taught and most of what they presented was utter bullshit. Fancy descriptions and gimmicky tools impressed me back then.

            I had so many online teachers with their special herbs and spices that the more I seemed to learn, the more confusing and frustrating the whole process became

            I had the sense to order a DVD from David Gardiner in the UK because his work was outstanding and he would post his process on a well known US forum from start to finish explaining what he did and why. What he did made sense to me. That led to another UK guy called Geoff Moss MPH Panels. Same tools, same approach, same outstanding quality.

            These two were classically trained in coachbuilding. Modest and relatable

            I offered to host a metal shaping weekend back in 2014. We live on a few acres and have a good size shed but I had few metal shaping tools and even less skill I received a call from a bloke in Melbourne by the name of Peter Tommasini.

            He explained that he was heading off to teach in the US and would be away at the time of our weekend but offered us the use of his cast iron English wheel. I drove down to Bayswater and saw what he did and the passion he had for his craft. 45 years in the game. Over the next few weeks before he headed off I soaked up as much knowledge as I could. Peter explained the process. Because it is a process He listened to my questions. He not only answered them but grabbed pieces of metal and showed me many of the techniques he had honed over his lifetime

            Slowly it dawned on me that I had absorbed so much wrong information. Trying to do massive shrinks when a bit of blocking would halve the workload and produce a better product The "gurus " I had been following were literally making shit up as they went along. Pete's approach was consistent with Mr Gardiner and Mr Moss. It was logical. It was the mastering of the basics and then adding machines to increase the output

            David Gardiner gave up posting on the US forum because he received so much flak from the inner circle who were not going to let a Pom show them how to do it. Peter copped the same . He left too Geoff Moss wont post on a forum. Immigrants not wanted. So we set up this forum. We wanted those who really wanted to learn to be shown the most efficient techniques . Skills that they could learn and master.

            I'll make you a deal. Buy Pete's DVD collection. Watch each video 3 times in sequence. No skipping. I guarantee you will learn . Not only what to do, but you will know what not to do. If you don't think you have received fantastic training, from a true professional, ring me on 0402 902 267 and I will refund your purchase. Send them back to me and I'll even pay the postage. I am serious.

            Having seen your previous projects ( I am a sucker for 240z's and early Porsche's ) you certainly have the talent and I would hate to see you led down the same path I started to follow

            Kind regard John

            Comment


            • Moving molecules .
              Moving molecules . commented
              Editing a comment
              Totally sums up Modern metal shaping.... you can spot a true craftsman mile away....

          • #7
            Well said John.

            I was incredibly lucky; a man I have never met, except on a Land Rover forum, told me about Peter and his DVD's. As soon as I watched the one on shrinking a flange, I understood how little I knew. I have watched them several times and pick up something each time.

            I like to test myself now, by predicting what will happen to the metal, before someone tries to shape it.

            My first attempt at a Land Rover wing went well and despite being imperfect, I understood how to make it better the next time. All of the skills and tools I have needed, have been sourced with Peter's help and instruction. One day I hope to meet the man.

            Gardiner, Moss and Peter, are the three masters I study. The rest of the internet crowd have vested interests and dodgy credentials, if they are claiming to be masters, with the exception of Kent White.

            Follow the advice on this forum Greg and you will learn the best methods,

            Cheers Charlie

            Comment


            • #8
              Thanks Charlie.

              When you do head down south of the border, let us know. We are hoping to organise a weekend later in the year... Unfortunately the habits you learn in the early stages tend to stay with you throughout the journey and they can really hold you back. I think we subconsciously think there's a faster or easier way and tend to gravitate to those seductive practices and gimmicks. G M and P are old school. Real craftsmen with thousands of hours of paying work under their belts I shy away from the slick salesmen who are really there to sell classes and tools. They know enough to pull the wool over the newbies eyes and sell the dream

              Ask Pete about the phone call he got from the US from a guy trying to do a reverse on a Gmund coupe. I think he realised that there was more to know than what he had been taught.......................

              Greg, I hope you understand that both Charlie and I only want you to succeed and are just trying to guide you.

              Cheers Johnny

              Comment


              • #9
                All of you members it's my greater pleasure to teach you guys what I have learned ( and yet still learning ), It's the only thing now days that I enjoy, simply because i got to the point that after only a few hours work I get tired , and possibly sick of dealing with clients as well , as I have deal with them for over 50 Years but life must go on , so in the near future I will retire from ( Peter Tommasini Classic Car Restorations ) and concentrate on the ''Handbuilt '' side of things, meaning more tools development , more classes , and more DVD's for the you tube Chanel , and more DVD's that can be purchase . As a matter of fact I am now working on my cast frame to be.... a English wheel , a planishing hammer and a bead roller ,or ( Jenny ) .......all for many type of applications

                I also like to thank you all for all you kind words , you all are a good bunch of guys
                Peter T.

                www.handbuilt.net.au
                Last edited by Peter Tommasini; 11-04-21, 09:52 AM.

                Comment


                • neilb
                  neilb commented
                  Editing a comment
                  well pete i am putting money aside so i can buy one of your cast frames, so don't sell your last one lol

              • #10
                Do not worry Neil .... I have a few in stock

                Comment


                • #11
                  Originally posted by Kiwi john View Post
                  Hi Greg. You have a great project underway. I am not sucking up to Peter but the reality is we started this forum to ensure that the time honoured and tested methods of metal shaping are slowly being lost. Not from the lack of interest but because if you have a camera and a Ewe Tube channel people will assume you are a guru.

                  I laugh now when I look back at some of the guys I used to follow. I didn't know what I didn't know and with hindsight I now realise I was gullible. I was desperate to learn but didn't realise most were self taught and most of what they presented was utter bullshit. Fancy descriptions and gimmicky tools impressed me back then.

                  I had so many online teachers with their special herbs and spices that the more I seemed to learn, the more confusing and frustrating the whole process became

                  I had the sense to order a DVD from David Gardiner in the UK because his work was outstanding and he would post his process on a well known US forum from start to finish explaining what he did and why. What he did made sense to me. That led to another UK guy called Geoff Moss MPH Panels. Same tools, same approach, same outstanding quality.

                  These two were classically trained in coachbuilding. Modest and relatable

                  I offered to host a metal shaping weekend back in 2014. We live on a few acres and have a good size shed but I had few metal shaping tools and even less skill I received a call from a bloke in Melbourne by the name of Peter Tommasini.

                  He explained that he was heading off to teach in the US and would be away at the time of our weekend but offered us the use of his cast iron English wheel. I drove down to Bayswater and saw what he did and the passion he had for his craft. 45 years in the game. Over the next few weeks before he headed off I soaked up as much knowledge as I could. Peter explained the process. Because it is a process He listened to my questions. He not only answered them but grabbed pieces of metal and showed me many of the techniques he had honed over his lifetime

                  Slowly it dawned on me that I had absorbed so much wrong information. Trying to do massive shrinks when a bit of blocking would halve the workload and produce a better product The "gurus " I had been following were literally making shit up as they went along. Pete's approach was consistent with Mr Gardiner and Mr Moss. It was logical. It was the mastering of the basics and then adding machines to increase the output

                  David Gardiner gave up posting on the US forum because he received so much flak from the inner circle who were not going to let a Pom show them how to do it. Peter copped the same . He left too Geoff Moss wont post on a forum. Immigrants not wanted. So we set up this forum. We wanted those who really wanted to learn to be shown the most efficient techniques . Skills that they could learn and master.

                  I'll make you a deal. Buy Pete's DVD collection. Watch each video 3 times in sequence. No skipping. I guarantee you will learn . Not only what to do, but you will know what not to do. If you don't think you have received fantastic training, from a true professional, ring me on 0402 902 267 and I will refund your purchase. Send them back to me and I'll even pay the postage. I am serious.

                  Having seen your previous projects ( I am a sucker for 240z's and early Porsche's ) you certainly have the talent and I would hate to see you led down the same path I started to follow

                  Kind regard John


                  Originally posted by Kiwi john View Post
                  Thanks Charlie.

                  When you do head down south of the border, let us know. We are hoping to organise a weekend later in the year... Unfortunately the habits you learn in the early stages tend to stay with you throughout the journey and they can really hold you back. I think we subconsciously think there's a faster or easier way and tend to gravitate to those seductive practices and gimmicks. G M and P are old school. Real craftsmen with thousands of hours of paying work under their belts I shy away from the slick salesmen who are really there to sell classes and tools. They know enough to pull the wool over the newbies eyes and sell the dream

                  Ask Pete about the phone call he got from the US from a guy trying to do a reverse on a Gmund coupe. I think he realised that there was more to know than what he had been taught.......................

                  Greg, I hope you understand that both Charlie and I only want you to succeed and are just trying to guide you.

                  Cheers Johnny
                  Man, Johnny- these two quotes should be a sticky "Mission Statement" or something like that. Charlie has good words, too. I know I bitch and ramble and probably step on toes sometimes, but I understand how influential those little ingrained tidbits- the things that pop up in your head when you are doing automatically without actively thinking- can be. There is no room for the wrong influence and there are no short cuts.

                  Better men make better men. Properly shaping men is much more difficult than properly shaping metal. Or at least it's more pc to hit metal with a hammer....

                  Comment


                  • #12
                    Wow guys, I am so glad I started this thread. I would have gone down the rabbit hole for sure. Thankyou for putting so much time and effort into the responses. I am still a way off starting to shape metal so I will certainly look into the best approach. Or at least the best approach I can achieve with my circumstances. I'll be purchasing a set of Peter's DVDs shortly.....thank goodness I have a second TV or my wife might divorce me on watching them 3 (or more) times. I might even have to move them into my shed.

                    Comment


                    • #13
                      Greg, I think you'll find with Peter's DVD's, if you watch a section and then go try the same process, then watch it again, you'll pick up things you missed the first time as the lack of mechanical experience kinda blocks you from grasping everything. The second or third time watching, having practiced it in between, you have an epiphany moment.....oh yeah, that's why that happened.

                      Comment


                      • #14
                        Originally posted by Kiwi john View Post
                        Hi Greg. You have a great project underway. I am not sucking up to Peter but the reality is we started this forum to ensure that the time honoured and tested methods of metal shaping are slowly being lost. Not from the lack of interest but because if you have a camera and a Ewe Tube channel people will assume you are a guru.

                        I laugh now when I look back at some of the guys I used to follow. I didn't know what I didn't know and with hindsight I now realise I was gullible. I was desperate to learn but didn't realise most were self taught and most of what they presented was utter bullshit. Fancy descriptions and gimmicky tools impressed me back then.

                        I had so many online teachers with their special herbs and spices that the more I seemed to learn, the more confusing and frustrating the whole process became

                        I had the sense to order a DVD from David Gardiner in the UK because his work was outstanding and he would post his process on a well known US forum from start to finish explaining what he did and why. What he did made sense to me. That led to another UK guy called Geoff Moss MPH Panels. Same tools, same approach, same outstanding quality.

                        These two were classically trained in coachbuilding. Modest and relatable

                        I offered to host a metal shaping weekend back in 2014. We live on a few acres and have a good size shed but I had few metal shaping tools and even less skill I received a call from a bloke in Melbourne by the name of Peter Tommasini.

                        He explained that he was heading off to teach in the US and would be away at the time of our weekend but offered us the use of his cast iron English wheel. I drove down to Bayswater and saw what he did and the passion he had for his craft. 45 years in the game. Over the next few weeks before he headed off I soaked up as much knowledge as I could. Peter explained the process. Because it is a process He listened to my questions. He not only answered them but grabbed pieces of metal and showed me many of the techniques he had honed over his lifetime

                        Slowly it dawned on me that I had absorbed so much wrong information. Trying to do massive shrinks when a bit of blocking would halve the workload and produce a better product The "gurus " I had been following were literally making shit up as they went along. Pete's approach was consistent with Mr Gardiner and Mr Moss. It was logical. It was the mastering of the basics and then adding machines to increase the output

                        David Gardiner gave up posting on the US forum because he received so much flak from the inner circle who were not going to let a Pom show them how to do it. Peter copped the same . He left too Geoff Moss wont post on a forum. Immigrants not wanted. So we set up this forum. We wanted those who really wanted to learn to be shown the most efficient techniques . Skills that they could learn and master.

                        I'll make you a deal. Buy Pete's DVD collection. Watch each video 3 times in sequence. No skipping. I guarantee you will learn . Not only what to do, but you will know what not to do. If you don't think you have received fantastic training, from a true professional, ring me on 0402 902 267 and I will refund your purchase. Send them back to me and I'll even pay the postage. I am serious.

                        Having seen your previous projects ( I am a sucker for 240z's and early Porsche's ) you certainly have the talent and I would hate to see you led down the same path I started to follow

                        Kind regard John


                        John, very well put. My "conversations" with other metal shapers here in the states from back in those early days when shaping forums were starting, are that the inventor of the facilitator did not care for stumps. I guess with people building wheeling machines for the masses, and other such tools, he had to make things out of steel, and no way this wooden block would work. They said it's funny to see someone now inventing what's been used for many years. Sure, it's made of 2X lumber and cut to the shape you want, but its a fukin stump! He had to change the name and continues to this day to talk down stumps so he won't be eating crow, but it's still a stump... The other thing I was made privy to, as I did not start metal shaping until more recently, was that he would come up with some kind of widget to move some metal. Then would show it to everybody. Everybody says "ooooooooh. metal moved" And then they would start making their own metal moving widget. regardless of how inefficient it might be. So basically it was the blind leading the blind. Unlike men like Peter and Jeff Moss, who learned the trade from other skilled men, and learned CORRECTLY, the traditional methods that were proven and EFFICIENT. Even a person of my limited abilities can watch the same videos and see that someone hasn't the slightest clue. Weld a patch next to a flange and wonder why the flange drops? The weld shrinks!! but he never did anything to planish out the weld to remove the low. Kept bumping up the flange and putting the bottom edge in tension which made a wave. Flatten the wave and the low reappears. And....he.....kept...… repeating, like it was magically going to change the 6th time he did the same thing.. Never did finish that did he? Put a spline in a MC fender and then try to duck tail the back end? The spline acts as a lock, it should be the last thing done. I understand why Clint doesn't like giving the guy a wider platform to spread his misinformation but I also think it could be a good learning tool in the proper setting to show why it was wrong, show what is the correct method, and why his methods are a complete waste of effort. After all, we learn better from our own mistakes, right??

                        Which brings up another point by a good friend of mine that Peter knows, Charlie Cerutti. Charlie says you can watch all those videos he puts out but NOTHING is ever completed. The latest repair/fabrication goes back in a corner to collect dust because the part never is an acceptable product. He is in the business of selling tools and selling classes. And because he doesn't entirely understand what the hell he's doing, all he can do is cater to those who don't yet know. Sad to say it is an extreme dis-service to those wanting to learn but they're being taught garbage.
                        Last edited by MP&C; 12-04-21, 03:27 AM.

                        Comment


                        • Chazza
                          Chazza commented
                          Editing a comment
                          Beautifully written Robert!

                          The bloke is a charlatan.

                      • #15
                        Originally posted by MP&C View Post



                        John, very well put. My "conversations" with other metal shapers here in the states from back in those early days when shaping forums were starting, are that the inventor of the facilitator did not care for stumps. I guess with people building wheeling machines for the masses, and other such tools, he had to make things out of steel, and no way this wooden block would work. They said it's funny to see someone now inventing what's been used for many years. Sure, it's made of 2X lumber and cut to the shape you want, but its a fukin stump! He had to change the name and continues to this day to talk down stumps so he won't be eating crow, but it's still a stump... The other thing I was made privy to, as I did not start metal shaping until more recently, was that he would come up with some kind of widget to move some metal. Then would show it to everybody. Everybody says "ooooooooh. metal moved" And then they would start making their own metal moving widget. regardless of how inefficient it might be. So basically it was the blind leading the blind. Unlike men like Peter and Jeff Moss, who learned the trade from other skilled men, and learned CORRECTLY, the traditional methods that were proven and EFFICIENT. Even a person of my limited abilities can watch the same videos and see that someone hasn't the slightest clue. Weld a patch next to a flange and wonder why the flange drops? The weld shrinks!! but he never did anything to planish out the weld to remove the low. Kept bumping up the flange and putting the bottom edge in tension which made a wave. Flatten the wave and the low reappears. And....he.....kept...… repeating, like it was magically going to change the 6th time he did the same thing.. Never did finish that did he? Put a spline in a MC fender and then try to duck tail the back end? The spline acts as a lock, it should be the last thing done. I understand why Clint doesn't like giving the guy a wider platform to spread his misinformation but I also think it could be a good learning tool in the proper setting to show why it was wrong, show what is the correct method, and why his methods are a complete waste of effort. After all, we learn better from our own mistakes, right??

                        Which brings up another point by a good friend of mine that Peter knows, Charlie Cerutti. Charlie says you can watch all those videos he puts out but NOTHING is ever completed. The latest repair/fabrication goes back in a corner to collect dust because the part never is an acceptable product. He is in the business of selling tools and selling classes. And because he doesn't entirely understand what the hell he's doing, all he can do is cater to those who don't yet know. Sad to say it is an extreme dis-service to those wanting to learn but they're being taught garbage.
                        ////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

                        Hi Robert
                        I could have not put it better my self ...... I I can also go a bit further ....listen to this ..

                        .About a Month ago I received a email from a guy in the US asking some help in building a particular type of Porsche, He said that he had some trouble making the rear return on the quarter , so I explained to him (the best way I could ) how to do the return , BUT I also said, that unless I had some pics of what he was trying to do , i could not help him much......WELL.. He send me the photo's and guess what ? In the picture I could see that the buck was the same one that Wray had in his shop ,and the same picture showed that ,the mess of that return was made there at Wray shop ,I know this because I have seen the same buck on the same spot on Wray video's . So after seen the pics I email the guy and said , [QUOTE] ...... DO I KNOW THAT PLACE , IT LOOKS FAMILIAR ? ...End of quote . after that email I never heard back from the guy , So what I am saying is that whatever way he was thought to make that quarter simply did not work and to make things worse ,if I remember rightly the guy paid a lot of US $ to do the 130 class with Wray

                        Peter T.

                        Comment

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