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1967 Moto Guzzi V700 Corsa-Record

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  • 1967 Moto Guzzi V700 Corsa-Record

    [quote author=cliffrod link=topic=102606.msg1623388#msg1623388 date=1567137511]
    I've been somewhat at a loss to get this project's build thread underway, so will just start. A lot of pics are being held hostage in my daughter's old & dysfunctional iPhone. For now, a little general background and info on the past year. Details will be a little jumbled for a while. I expect others have similar issues with their projects before things start to become focused and more coherent.

    this is also an experiment to see if I can post & display more than 5 pics within a single thread entry. If it works and we can figure out how to do it every time on purpose, it may prove to be the biggest contribution I ever make to this forum. It may require some type of online hosting source for the image like photobucket or another site. This entry was copied & pasted from a Moto Guzzi forum which employs imgbur? As a no cost image host for forum members. If not, well... at least I tried.

    In 1969, Moto Guzzi lacked a racing, sport or performance version of their new flagship V Twin engine. They enlisted Lino Tonti to repurpose two new Ambassadors to demonstrate the performance potential of the new V Twin engine platform. One would compete in 750 cc class and one in 1000 cc class. The stock bikes were basically stripped, then specifically equipped & modified for the task at hand. Over two days at Monza in October 1969, 19 world records were set. These two bikes were never campaigned or used otherwise. One was retired to the MG factory museum, where it remains to this day. The other one came to the USA through Berliner. It was sold to a private individual and was ultimately parted out and forever lost.

    These World Record achievements was widely publicized by MG, including in subsequent magazine ads. Based upon the results, MG began development of a dedicated V Twin sport model. Tonti was reported disappointed with the loop frame's performance, so he designed a totally new frame for the new sport model. The result was the V7 Sport, with the now legendary Tonti frame. The World Record bikes are the forefathers of all subsequent factory sport bikes and provided many styling cues for later models.

    I've had my 1973 Moto Guzzi V7 Sport for many years. Never had a Loop or much interest in them. In July 2018, I acquired an incomplete 1967 V700 (complete frame and front end, driveline and swing arm with no wheels/brakes, final drive, speedo, sheet metal, etc) for $200.00 with the intent of parting it out. As we were unloading it at home I found the engine turned with compression. Then I learned more about the Record bikes and decided such a build would make a great partner for my V7 Sport. I sold nearly all my bikes establishing my studio and such a project is exactly what I've planned to do for many, many years.

    Between July 2018 and July 2019, most time was spent chasing regular and obscure parts, doing research and making some actual build progress. Greg Bender put me in touch with another fan (who has been a great help) who is building a more faithful replica of the original racetrack-dedicated Record bikes. Mine is intended to be close to the original bikes, but will be a street legal bike with lights. The original bikes were purpose-built tools that were used and essentially discarded, not refined machines produced per committee & engineering edict. I hope to deliberately produce a comparable result in a nod towards authenticity of their spontaneous, utilitarian development, but not because I cannot produce accurate work.

    This project is as much sculpture as functional motorcycle to me. I plan to both ride it and enjoy it as a work of art. I'm not building it to satisfy anyone except me. Metal shaping & panel work is a different means of exploring shape for me. It is not a reductive or additive method. It is about moving only the surface plane into a new configuration. My available time and funds vary significantly, so I have no set schedule for completion. After the bike is completely built, I will address the mechanical rebuild.

    I'll likely edit to add some pics as I coordinate between multiple devices. If you're interested, check back at these initial posts. Right now, I'm only trying to get started.

    There's limited accurate information about these bikes and the various configurations in which they are pictured. Nearly all we have are contemporary pictures and additional modern pictures taken at the MG Museum.

    Some pics-

    This screenshot is a picture from Monza of one of the bikes without fairing, different front end detail and no rear brakes

    <br /><br />

    Other side, maybe the same bike but not sure-

    <br /><br />

    I began with very simple templates (tank was made from a Busch Light case chipboard) and then began producing a clay model on wood armature of half of the tank and seat. I regularly do clay or plastilina models for my professional sculpture work, with only pictures or drawings as reference. This process was no different. No CAD, no CNC. Just low tech pencil, paper, ruler, bandsaw, belt sander, etc. and lots of practice.

    <br /><br />

    Studying other bike builds, many people will build a tank shell and then try to figure out how to do the tank tunnel & mount as an afterthought. Not cool. I wanted to design the tunnel first. My V7 Sport has oem tank bushings around the top tube that I like much better than the typical foam & electrical tape.. Problem is the Loop frame top tube is much larger. After searching for an off the shelf item, like a large sway bar bushing, I made what I needed. I sourced some urethane spring die stock via craigslist. This material was sawed to width. The center was offset cut to diameter with a hole saw, using a fixture to hold the die stock. The rest of the shaping was done with belt sander and grinder.

    <br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />

    I also made two 1/2" thick bumpers to match the tank bushings. I'll mount these to help keep the tank vertical-
    <br /><br />

    Bushings on the frame-
    <br /><br />

    Along with bike details like the distributor and coil, these tank bushings helped develop the pattern for the tunnel as the buck was produced.

    After the clay models of tank and seat were deemed suitable, I developed poster board templates directly from the clay to produce buck stations. These patterns were reversed to provide matching stations for each side of the tank and seat. The tank buck was produced as indentical halves, so the joint between the halves would serve as centerline. Furniture-grade 3/4" maple plywood was used.

    Tank backbone halves, assembled-
    <br /><br /><br />

    In process, adding stations-
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    Assembled with all stations cut to approximate contour but not faired-
    <br />

    The seat buck stations were produced as full width upon a solid base.

    <br /><br /><br /><br />

    The rear fender is an abbreviated piece that ends under the seat on the original bikes. Having made a fender eliminator for an XR1000 in the past that was carefully measured but quickly gobbled by the rear wheel, I tried to make this one with adequate clearance. Two radii- one to the front fender mount on the battery tray and the other to the rear fender most on the frame loop- were blended. The cross section fender radius, which is the same on these two original mounts, was also used. A buck was produced using this information.

    <br /><br /><br /><br /><br />[/url]<br />

    Not sure how long or short the rear fender will actually be. Also not sure how the seat and fender will fit together. Seat may need a slight bulge for clearance. After I make the parts and fit all together with the tail light, more decisions will be made.

    Pics of the tank and seat bucks on the bike, very cool...-

    <br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />

    More later...

  • #2
    Hot dog! It works!!!!


    • #3

      Mwy projects are often drawn out, with necessary tangents and opportunities taking priority as they arise. Here's a few details of parts chasing over the past year-

      Guzzi offered no tachometer on the early Loop bikes. There was no provision in the timing chest for a mechanical tach until the V7 Sport was released and the now familiar Moto Guzi black faced Veglia electronic tach had not yet been produced. We studied pictures to decide the brand of tach used and then I determined the specifc model. No speedometer was fitted. For the Record bikes, Tonti use an aftermarket VDO electric tachometer suitable for 6V or 12V and adjustable for use on 2, 4, 6 or 8 cylinder engines. Apparently it was not a special or highly collectible tachometer. This made finding one to be a challenge.

      After enough searching, one dealer was located in the Netherlands who searched his inventory of 1500+ gauges for approx 3 months to produce a single, almost correct NOS tach. The Record bikes had tachs with a black trim ring, presumably to limit potential for glare when riding at high speed. The NOS tach has a chrome trim ring, which I may leave as is or simply paint black. During those three months of unknown results, I found another similar VDO tach. It was/is well used and with the proper blacked-out trim ring, but has an adjustable rev limit pointer with corresponding penetration through the lens. Not sure that it works, but having a one to service just in case was prudent.

      Ok- this is what the code for the following image looks like. the only thing I've done is done to make it visible is to leave off the < and. > before and after this string br /><br /><br /. Looks like if we can incorporate a supplemental image hosting site as individuals or as an entire forum, we can make more coherent & sophisticated posts.

      <br /><br /><br />


      The original Record bikes were built to pursue top speed records. both bikes were equipped with 38mm remote bowl Dellorto SS2 carbs on straightened intakes which point approximately straight towards the respective vertical frame members near the swing arm. My bike did have both original 29mm SS1 carbs, which are tempting to run. But, between their real world traffic manners and the fact that I'll upgrade to 750 cylinders during the mechanical rebuild, I'll likely change carbs. I have an excellent pair of square slide 30mm VHB carbs, just like those on my V7 Sport, and this pair of 32mm PHB carbs, which would look a little more like the original SS2 carbs.

      No decision has been made yet- maybe someone can offer feedback from experience, especially regarding changing carbs, intake configuration and adding custom headpipes with reverse cone megaphone exhaust all at once?

      <br /><br />

      Tail light

      A pet peeve with many customs is how often the details cheapen the end result. Seeing another cheap no name aftermarket, Model A, HD limp dick or whatever dime a dozen tail light loses me. This is an Italian bike. It should have Italian parts. One of my all time favorite tail lights that no one uses is the late 50's & early 60's CEV horizontal D tail light that came on bikes like the Ducati Elite and others. It's simply gorgeous. This form apparently inspired many later bikes which feature a larger but similar horizontal D tail light.

      This unit originally uses a pair of tiny 6v barrel bulbs, so I will have to upgrade the lamp assembly. I sourced a pair of new tail light assemblies from Italy, which was more economical than buying a single $$$ one on eBay from here in the USA. It will nestle nicely in a trimmed-out portion of the seat hump and be nice having a light with CEV and part numbers on the chrome bezel.... Very cool. Not sure if this will also be the license plate mount I will use, but that would make sense. Once this light, seat and rear fender are arranged and in place, I'll decide how short to cut the rear fender.

      <br />

      After assembling a pair of Tommaselli clip ons and matador levers to use (just because that would match my V7 Sport), I was able to identify and then source a pair of original style clip-ons using welded perches and parallel cable exit. No pics since these bars haven't been ordered yet, but will be ordered with other needed parts directly from Italy as funds allow.


      • #4
        Just deleted the quote command from the beginning of this copy & paste from WildGuzzi to make sure pics would still be visible. It seems to still show the pics. Very very cool!


        • #5
          I'll tidy up my build thread edit & pics sometime soon.

          Too much easy success and positive accomplishment too quickly will probably go to my head. My wife already says I need to not be such a know-it-all..... Time to quit doing forum & metal stuff, step back into the real world, mow the lawns and try to replace the ball joints on my wife's 4Runner HiLux for the rest of the weekend....


          • #6
            Good stuff Cliff, keep it coming.


            • #7

              Ok, still figuring after seeing the pic was duplicated in my bold explanation above, I eliminated the <br /> before and after the image code string, plus the surrounding [ and ] so it should look like this.


              And then copied and pasted the same here, with [ and ] included-

              Beyond showing the viability of an offsite image hosting site, Maybe this will make sense to people more computer-tech savvy than me...? Hope I'm not stirring up a giant PIA for admin. I'm pretty good at stepping in it.

              edit- just in case I've gone too far... jiggly machines rule! FSP 's suck!....
              Last edited by cliffrod; 31-08-19, 05:53 PM. Reason: see edit...


              • #8
                Ok, this is the image hosting site used for the images above.


                Free image hosting and sharing service, upload pictures, photo host. Offers integration solutions for uploading images to forums.


                • #9
                  Cliffy, you are a legend! You understand computers!

                  Love the work on your bike as well,

                  Cheers Charlie


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by cliffrod View Post
                    jiggly machines rule! FSP 's suck!....
                    classic lol

                    how long before you get to do some hammering cliffy?

                    thanks neil


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by neilb View Post

                      classic lol

                      how long before you get to do some hammering cliffy?
                      Using my jiggly machine- who knows? It's here, but will be a while.

                      plina old hammering has already begun. Rear fender and seat pieces are largely done and being fitted now before some welding starts. Tank buck needs a little more work before that metal work starts. I've waited until some parts are actually photo ready to start this thread. The order of operations on this project means a number of items need to be produced in sequential order for them to fit. Lots to coordinate.

                      More to post asap.


                      • #12
                        Nice job
                        David Bradbury


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by neilb View Post

                          classic lol

                          how long before you get to do some hammering cliffy?
                          Eye candy for you, while I sort out details and work on posting buck details win pics I already have.. I've got to start on my next stone immediately and get this reciprocating machine moved inside a sap, so I expect nearly all bike & metal stuff will be mothballed for 4-6 wks.


                          • #14
                            More copy-paste from latest WildGuzzi forum post a few minutes ago-

                            This project is largely one of a predicated order. Many of the specific details are dependent upon neighboring changes. The more it was studied, the more clear it became where to begin.

                            As the build began, one of the first steps was to remove the front end tin. The fork shrouds with headlight ears and chrome spring covers crimped to the lowers were removed from the Record bikes. Springs were left exposed, as was common on many Italian specials and race bikes, and the spring cups were retained. Removing the tins facilitated use of clip-on handlebars. I have always wanted a vintage Italian sporting bike with such exposed springs...

                            The lower or rear front fender mount was then rotated to be parallel to the fork lowers, a tab was added to each side and then bolted to the upper fender mount receiver. This served as a simple fork brace.

                            Both chrome covers are waiting to be removed and the fork brace to be finished.

                            I will retain the long headlight and fabricate mounts that look related to the great looking headlight ears found on the V7 Sport. The larger headlight will house any necessary electrical components.

                            The V700 and Ambassador had similar but not identical top fork plates, triple tree, etc. these were steel covered by the large alloy valance that houses the speedometer and warning lights. Everything except the steel plate was missing from my bike. It basically looked like this-

                            At this point,with the tank buck in place, it's obvious that this won't work. So Tonti modified the steel top plate and made a simple aluminum valance to cover it. The V700 front end/top plate has greater offset than later versions. This creates a steeper front end and faster steering which is typically associated with sporting bikes. Jeff, the previously mentioned Record bike fan, modified a V700 offset top plate before learning Tonti used a later top plate with less offset- presumably for a longer wheelbase and greater top speed stability. His build is more accurate than mine. I planned to modify & use my original V700 parts. But before I modified mine, he sent me his spare set.

                            Side by side, the difference between stock and modified is easy to see. Now the two rear corners of the top plate easily clear the tank buck with steering at full lock.

                            The alloy top plate valance was painted black on the Record bikes, as this one will be, I may make another one, as some pics show smaller top bolts & corresponding holes than the very large fork top tube retaining nuts. More research to do..

                            Last edited by cliffrod; 01-09-19, 08:41 PM. Reason: edit- correcting spellcheck again...


                            • #15
                              More copy & paste from WildGuzzi-

                              After the modified top plate/ triple tree was in place, I began working on the tank. Using pics of the unfaired bikes plus this image from the MG Museum of the existing original Record Bike with full fairing, I began-

                              At some point, I do plan to make a full fairing assembly like this one. For now, that part of the project can wait.

                              Initially, a 2D chipboard cut-out was made from a beer case box for the seat to go with a simple plywood mock-up.

                              Then I began wedging plastilina (non-hardening microcrystalline clay) onto a wooden armature to further develop the tank and seat in 3D. Many will scan and use computer technology as a priority. I like doing it myself. this is also how all my studio models are produced. This clay is not really hard enough to do proper vehicle body panel development or pattern work, but it's what have I and use. For this project, it was adequate.

                              Working alone in studio can complicate one's ability to maintain perspective. Without someone else's input for a sounding board, I've found it helps to have divergent projects working at the same time. Time away from one helps clarify the other. Over the winter and spring, the clay for tank and seat took shape very well.

                              Finally, I decided tank and seat clay models to be finished and it was time to begin work on fabricating the wooden bucks-

                              More soon...