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  • Lead loading / Wiping.

    Have any of you tried Leadloading the Old way we’re you use flux first and when use Tinman,s Solder 40 Tin 60 Lead , then Body solder 30/70.

    l was shown the old method when l was younger by one old boy, but have since used the paste method.

    If you have any experience with this please share before this information is lost.
    https://www.precisionpanelcraft.co.uk/

  • #2
    I must say that I never try the first method mentioned above , I always used 30/70 lead with thinning paste
    Peter T.

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    • #3
      Click image for larger version

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ID:	4898 Here is some old Workshop info from BMC.
      https://www.precisionpanelcraft.co.uk/

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      • #4
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        https://www.precisionpanelcraft.co.uk/

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        • #5
          My friend used to use the method with the tinsman's solder; it worked very well.

          What he did discover, after melting some body solder off a wreck, was that somehow the solder had degraded and wouldn't work. He had to buy new body solder,

          Cheers Charlie

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          • #6
            This it’s something I’ve been thinking about.

            They say you can reuse the scrapings..... but like you say it never works as good the second time around .

            my belief is because Tin is the lower melting Metal at around 232Deg C , and because we often use oxy/acetylene we could be decreasing the percentage of TIn ???? ...

            Tinmans Solder being 40% Tin 60% Lead
            Body Solder being 30% Tin (Sn) 70% Lead ( Pb)

            l think l will melt it all down and weigh it in and buy some new sticks for next year.

            When l remade the Aston Martin DB 2/4 mklll in 2017 l must of melted 5 to 6 lb of lead of the screen pillars it was a bloody bodged job being a convertible.

            Also because we don’t do lead work that much some Fluxes have a shelflife , so when you go to use it it doesn’t work properly.

            Last edited by Moving molecules .; 31-12-20, 11:42 AM.
            https://www.precisionpanelcraft.co.uk/

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            • #7
              Will look into trying to make some with the right percentage of Tin in it.👍
              https://www.precisionpanelcraft.co.uk/

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              • #8
                The percentage may be by weight, or by volume?

                Let us know if you find out,

                Cheers Charlie

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                • #9
                  as sensitive as any flux & solder/braze process is to contamination, I cannot imagine that recycled body solder is as clean as new solder. Paint, dirt, oils, oxidation, old paint, salts from sweat, ????. The more surface area exposed, the greater potential for contamination. Even filings produced in newly applied solder with a steel tool like a cheese grater would likely add minute amounts of iron or iron oxide contamination to solder. Some of those contaminants may be more likely to oxidize during the reheating process than the base metals in the solder alloy, leaving undesirable residues.

                  Recycled solder is probably best reserved it for projects that aren't as important. I'm pretty cheap and hate to waste anything, but sometimes you cant save money by being cheap. I do a lot of brazing building & rebuilding my stone tools and would like to do body solder.

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                  • #10
                    I would only use the 30/70 for body work, as it work like butter, Easy melt and adherence, blends into remounted solder after dressing and doesn't get air entrapment if and after you have applied it and dressed it out.
                    The 40/60 tends to be brittle a lot harder to work and very hard to remelt into itself if you have to build it up.
                    I use the Bakers flux and after tinning wash the whole work area to neutralise the flux, any residual burns and bubbles, so easy to tell where you've missed.
                    During work I keep the floor clean and Filings are swept up and I remelt those back into sticks, using a Camp cooker and pot, You mustn't overheat the the filings otherwise adherence issues will be a bugger, the sticks need to be shiny not whitish with a opaque appearance, is so don't use them to build up your work as melt into existing work will show cracking at the edges or peel off.
                    They say lead is Dangerous, But if Billy Hines smoked and slung lead all his life then it cant be to bad.

                    Cheers Reedy,

                    There's nothing as Sweet as a EK V8

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                    • #11
                      Few more from the E Type I restored.
                      Cheers Reedy,

                      There's nothing as Sweet as a EK V8

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by OldnEK View Post
                        I would only use the 30/70 for body work, as it work like butter, Easy melt and adherence, blends into remounted solder after dressing and doesn't get air entrapment if and after you have applied it and dressed it out.
                        The 40/60 tends to be brittle a lot harder to work and very hard to remelt into itself if you have to build it up.
                        I use the Bakers flux and after tinning wash the whole work area to neutralise the flux, any residual burns and bubbles, so easy to tell where you've missed.
                        During work I keep the floor clean and Filings are swept up and I remelt those back into sticks, using a Camp cooker and pot, You mustn't overheat the the filings otherwise adherence issues will be a bugger, the sticks need to be shiny not whitish with a opaque appearance, is so don't use them to build up your work as melt into existing work will show cracking at the edges or peel off.
                        They say lead is Dangerous, But if Billy Hines smoked and slung lead all his life then it cant be to bad.
                        Is there a practical way to flux (not sure if that's the right term- maybe Charlie knows) the molten solder during reclaiming to capture impurities as dross so they can be removed for better performance later?

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                        • #13

                          'Is there a practical way to flux (not sure if that's the right term- maybe Charlie knows) the molten solder during reclaiming to capture impurities as dross so they can be removed for better performance later?' Cliffrod.

                          If the solder scraps were melted in a graphite or clay crucible at a low temp to prevent boiling of the lead and tin, any dross can be skimmed off the top after stirring.

                          I suspect that you and MM are correct, in assuming that high melt temperatures and impurities cause problems.

                          Only one way to find out,

                          Cheers Charlie

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                          • #14
                            Gardiner's Youtube movie; from memory he tins first with 60/40.

                            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUwBxIm03Jc

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Chazza View Post
                              'Is there a practical way to flux (not sure if that's the right term- maybe Charlie knows) the molten solder during reclaiming to capture impurities as dross so they can be removed for better performance later?' Cliffrod.

                              If the solder scraps were melted in a graphite or clay crucible at a low temp to prevent boiling of the lead and tin, any dross can be skimmed off the top after stirring.

                              I suspect that you and MM are correct, in assuming that high melt temperatures and impurities cause problems.

                              Only one way to find out,

                              Cheers Charlie
                              Spot on Charlie, skimming off the impurities is the way to go.

                              I think some of the problems I have faced I think some of the problems I have faced is Old Flux .

                              I think I would like to do some Leading this year but like the Old Method I was shown at evening college.

                              1. Clean to bare metal extremely well.

                              2. then do it again.....👍 80grit.

                              3. warm up the metal to take out moisture.

                              4. apply new Flux .....( let’s try some makes too see which is best).

                              5 . Apply Tinmans Solder 60 Lead 40 Tin.

                              6. As Morris Workshop manual advises..... Re - Flux
                              over Tinmans Solder so BodySolder can Adhere ???........ This is the bit I cannot remember from years ago.

                              7. Shape Lead with Maple wood paddles or Custom bread knife blades.

                              8. Dlp puddles in Tallow but wipe of All excess...👍

                              9. I think this is important .... to clean off all FLUX residue with Warm water before Lead Filling ....
                              my thinking is you are preventing pushing the Flux residue into the New Lead.

                              10. File Lead and Shape.

                              11. Finish by more warm water and maybe add I bicarbonate of soda which ups the pH of the water to neutralise the acid.

                              12. and to be sure you cleaned .... clean area with Thinners.

                              like I say I haven’t done this method for 20 years so please amend if you have any tips and tricks.

                              cheers Matt.
                              Last edited by Moving molecules .; 04-01-21, 08:22 AM.
                              https://www.precisionpanelcraft.co.uk/

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