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  • Coronavirus the World has shutdown.

    Wonder what everyone thinks about all of this? I'm just incredulous about all the fear among people. Yes people have died but for a relatively healthy person with no underlying conditions you are not going to die. Thing that gets me is on 2009-2010 there was the swine flu pandemic which hardly even got talked about here in the US. I mean almost no coverage whatsoever. 80 million infected, 300,000 hospitalized. Lots of people died from it. 18,000 total and estimated 1800 children here in the US died from it. Those are numbers from the CDC. Where was the mass hysteria? Here in the US a country of 327 million people the death toll is still well under 100 people. Every death in the US has been of someone who had a serious pre-existing condition and was over the age of 50. The average age of death in Italy with the Corona virus is 81. How many people died of heart disease in the time frame of this virus? Car accidents? Suicide? Many more than have died from this virus.
    With the entire world essentially shutdown this is going to cause significant economic pain for the whole world. Recession almost certainly and quite possible a worldwide depression. All over what? Please tell me that I am not alone in my thinking.
    Last edited by Chris_Hamilton; 17-03-20, 11:42 PM.

  • #2
    No easy answers, other than I hope that if we can discuss this here, it doesn't turn into a raging a--hole political / conspiracy theory / religion free-for-all. Another forum I'm on is deleting all cv19 threads because people can't be grown ups and stay on point. No need for us to devolve into that. Neil doesn't need that problem.

    Hard to compare today to 10 yrs ago, in terms of the Internet and information. No political intent here, but when pres Obama was elected he had approx 120 followers on Twitter. That's a massive difference from how people are connected & info is shared now. I was doing a huge international protest over the MLK national memorial in 09-10 and had great difficulty gaining info online because people weren't connected then like they are now.

    The latest stat reported this afternoon is that in high risk populations like 80+ yr olds, the fatality rate is around 15%. It isn't 100% but is 10x the 1.4% fatality number already being presented as an overall number. Still, stats are incomplete so these numbers are only observed and probably not statistically significant. in nature, disease regularly thins populations when density or numbers reach a given threshold. After the thinning, subsequent cycles aren't perceived to be as bad because there are fewer in the extreme at-risk categories. Growing up as a farmer and hunter, that's just normal stuff. To address it, you isolate, limit numbers, clean, vaccinate, change protocols, etc. that's basically what is being asked & done by officials now.

    In the end, I'm concerned that this will expedite the shift to life online- working via Internet and more. I expect some things will be lost and never really recover. Also curious if this will be a somewhat single event or become adjust another strain of annual or semi-annual flu.

    No matter, stay safe and think about the bigger picture. Just like the Internet/information world has changed, it's hard to see things today in the same way that you'll see them in the future. This is probably a good time to err on the side of caution. most people don't spend a lot of their life focused upon the finality of death until they absolutely have to. Me, I cut headstones for a living....

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    • #3
      Peoples need to be safe has overtaken peoples want to live. Willingly give up Liberty for Safety. Not how I want to live. Older I get the less I like where Society is headed. This will have lasting effects on how people live and are allowed to live their lives. Life shouldn't just be about existing; staying safe and not taking any risks. Life should be about living, both the good and the bad.

      I think of a guy like Indian Larry, some might say it was senseless how he died, but he died living his life doing something he loved. Same with Jessi Combs, she died living. There are worst things than death.
      Last edited by Chris_Hamilton; 18-03-20, 01:12 AM.

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      • #4
        The biggest issue is if it doesn't get under control, is the hospitals being jam packed, overflowing. Doctors, nurses working around the clock, getting sick themselves. People with other emergency health issues may die waiting in the emergency waiting room.
        Pugsy

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        • #5
          All very true.... we are all lucky to live to a ripe old age nowadays .... and we should be grateful for that , in mediaeval times the average life expectancy was 32 .

          viruses have been around for thousands of years and will continue to mutate and change eventually wiping us out as a species .

          Our planet is expected to last 75 to 100,000,000 years Before the Sun engulfs our solar system .... One thing is for sure we won’t be around .

          just because we have the technology to name something they shouldn’t scare us into the latest Academic .

          The average UK mortality rate per day normally is 1400 ..... but remember people are also born ........ it’s just the equilibrium of life ...

          China is so over populated that people have to live in cubes and I also pay an awful lot for it .... that’s no life .

          Please common sense..... enjoy your life enjoy metal shaping and go hide in your shed with a beer ....

          i’ll drink to that .

          and remember how lucky we all are here on Earth .....And also remember where your metal molecules come from.....

          Inside a Dying Star heating up to a phenomenal temperature creating the atoms that we have to make are metal dreams ..... Gold is created at the hottest temperature heart in the centre of a star which makes it the most precious metals out there .... sorry to bore you .
          Last edited by Moving molecules .; 18-03-20, 12:24 PM.
          https://www.precisionpanelcraft.co.uk/

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          • #6
            personally i think it's all sad, i remember a quote from a movie ''a person is smart, people are dumb stupid panicky animals''

            little story for you, our lass's mom was queuing at the supermarket this morning, chatting to a woman about how ridicules this all is. this woman then say's when she was waiting in line the day before a woman told her she had 1200 rolls of toilet paper at home and was queuing for some more.

            really how much bog roll do you need? if you run out get in the shower and wash your arse! come on people think....

            i will add a little fact people still contract the bubonic plague to this day! never mind the flu, and it's not just 3rd world countries that have it!


            i don't mind people discussing what ever you like, that's why i put that section in, it helps us all get to know each other. we are all adults



            just don't hoard toilet paper!....
            thanks neil

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            • #7
              Yes... unfortunately it's happen , and the whole World need to deal with it the best way possible . Some how let's hope that we all get over this soon
              Peter T.

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              • #8
                As mentioned in another post, these precautions are for the first responders, medical workers, and such. We could be all over this pandemic in a couple of weeks if we all caught it at the same time, but many more susceptible people would die, and the medical care system would collapse. As a electrical utility worker, I know all too well what working weeks on end is like trying to restore power after natural weather disasters. Add germs and sick people on top of that......hats off to the medical community.

                The hoarding is a natural panic response. Like Neil stated, just jump in the shower, use something else if necessary....people don't think when they panic. Now is not the time to horde, now is the time to share and help our fellow man.

                Stay safe brothers, we'll get through this!

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                • #9
                  My hippy wife was laughing about the "social isolation" concept. She's not a big people person and has lived that way for years. Now she jokes that she has an official name for it...

                  Aside from a likely slowdown in income (hard to imagine it getting even slower...) Caring for my mother (78) and uncle (90) is the big challenge now. My uncle is fully comfortable to die. I told him a quick death would be fine. Almost dying or spending a lengthy hospital stay (live or die) will be the problem. The latter will likely leave a bankruptcy-level bill to be settled. I would rather not have to handle that mess.

                  no matter. Time for a typical reality check. Right now my wife is at the kitchen counter, happily sifting red clay from our back yard through a screen sieve I just made for her. She'll sift it more beyond that, then grind the fined results in her mortar & pestle. The plan is for her to paint the living room with paint pigmented with this red clay, some granite dust from the studio and more. Her project, not mine. This isn't stir-crazy, need-to-get-out-of-the-house stuff. Just another normal day around here.

                  At least her opossum is sleeping quietly and not snoring for a change....
                  Click image for larger version

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                  • #10
                    I'm sick and tired of the Chinese generating a new virus every few years, then hiding it, jailing medical professionals who try to expose it, then giving it to the rest of the world and only admitting to it when the evidence is overwhelming. The Chinese government need to be made to PAY for a chunk of the costs incurred which will be in the hundreds of billions I suspect when all is said and done. And the lefty news media says not "to be racist" and blame the Chinese. Who are we supposed to blame, the Norwegians?
                    The only ray of sunshine us that Kaiser - of all people - have a vaccine in stage 1 trials in Washington state already. That's good work!

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                    • #11
                      I suggest blaming anyone is a pointless activity.

                      Given that the World is over-populated and that so many live with their animals and with poor hygiene, it is inevitable that pandemics will come to visit us in the future.

                      In the meantime, washing hands frequently and avoiding touching communal surfaces, is still the best way to remain uninfected, whether avoiding Covid-19 or not.

                      After the SARS epidemic, WHO advised every Govt in the World to have a national-plan for combating the next epidemic/pandemic. 10 countries only developed a national-plan!

                      Maybe we should examine the performance of our politicians more closely,

                      Cheers Charlie

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                      • Steve Murphy
                        Steve Murphy commented
                        Editing a comment
                        that wiould be a good start Chazza

                    • #12
                      Well ya'll can hoard dunny roll as much as you like. I've had to buy a forklift to move my pallets of Chardonnay, strong cheese and Dutch Almond fingers around in the shed.
                      Cheers, Richard

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                      • #13
                        Originally posted by Chazza View Post
                        I suggest blaming anyone is a pointless activity.

                        Given that the World is over-populated and that so many live with their animals and with poor hygiene, it is inevitable that pandemics will come to visit us in the future.

                        In the meantime, washing hands frequently and avoiding touching communal surfaces, is still the best way to remain uninfected, whether avoiding Covid-19 or not.

                        After the SARS epidemic, WHO advised every Govt in the World to have a national-plan for combating the next epidemic/pandemic. 10 countries only developed a national-plan!

                        Maybe we should examine the performance of our politicians more closely,

                        Cheers Charlie

                        WHO was the same organization that in January said not to worry it wasn't transferable human to human. WHO is a corrupt organization much like the United Nations.

                        Google "WHO and China"

                        https://www.cfr.org/blog/who-and-china-dereliction-duty

                        We need to stop putting faith in these Global groups like the WHO and the UN. They are corrupt at the highest level.
                        Last edited by Chris_Hamilton; 19-03-20, 11:38 AM.

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                        • #14
                          Originally posted by Chris_Hamilton View Post


                          WHO was the same organization that in January said not to worry it wasn't transferable human to human. WHO is a corrupt organization much like the United Nations.

                          Google "WHO and China"

                          https://www.cfr.org/blog/who-and-china-dereliction-duty

                          We need to stop putting faith in these Global groups like the WHO and the UN. They are corrupt at the highest level.
                          Blame is simple. Solutions are normally hard, slow, unrewarding jobs that most think someone else should do.

                          I've been on Planning Commmission for years and have been to nearly all City Council meetings for 12+ yrs. In local politics (city council level) we regularly have all manner of experts telling us what we ought to do. Then they leave. Sometimes they come back and complain more. Usually they don't. The few who claim they're serious may participate at some level (new committee, try to join an existing group, etc) for a few months. Then they burn out and leave. The same core group is there for years. No pay. No thank yous. You can generally plan on the same exact people to be there in the audience every month. Nobody else cares. But we're trying to make a difference. Doesn't matter what political affiliation or perspective they have.

                          To ascend to greater office is even more involved & complicated. People who want everything done differently will ultimately employ the same strategies and structures to fill the operation with like-minded people. It's what people do. The first people that support someone are their friends. Then friends of those friends. Then everyone who "helped you get there" expects to be remembered, whether it's a instant-access conversation or more...

                          Talk is cheap. It's easy to say what ought to be done or play sideline quarterback. It's a lot harder to actually do it, because you WILL either succeed or fail.

                          The other part of the current scenario is that nobody really cares what happens until they lose their job. Then it's important.

                          No reason to panic. One could check out and live that dillygaf mindset life that people like Inidan Larry pretended to live. It's important to remember that he wanted people to look at him because he spent his life showing off to be relevant. That means he really did care what people think, which means he was a fraud just like so many leaders and politicians. He doesn't care who drank the KoolAid he was pushing, as long as they kept drinking and making him relevant.

                          Lots of corruption everywhere... So when does it count, when doesn't it count and who decides?

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                          • #15
                            So Indian Larry was a fraud and all Politicians are virtuous. Ok thanks.
                            Last edited by Chris_Hamilton; 19-03-20, 06:48 PM.

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